While the so-called “technical revolution” may have a positive impact on the problems of resource availability, pollution, water supply problems, and other such issues for a while, it is no panacea. The fact is that the earth is finite, and production will ultimately run into that fact. Expansion of the economy, and ever-increasing production cannot go on forever. Even now we are taking farmland out of production at a record pace due to a shortage of water, or to build more of Pete Seeger’s “little boxes”. Perhaps of greater concern is that the world’s rain forests are being cut down at an alarming rate. These forests, called “the lungs of the planet”, produce much of the oxygen in our atmosphere,
All the while we continue creating more people. Even colonizing the moon won’t help creating a stable population on earth. The 5.5 Billion ppl on earth who are living in the third world add 84 million to the world’s population every year. Try shipping 84 million to Mars or the Moon each year to stabilize population on earth.
Yes, if you fly over the country at night it looks like there’s lots of “open space”, but fly over during the day and that space is farmland, except for areas that are unsuitable. Overpopulation has nothing to do with empty space. It has everything to do with the ability to produce what is required, provide resources where necessary, and the ability to get the necessary materials/products/resources to where they are needed.
Third world countries like Somalia, and Ethiopia rely on food from elsewhere in the world because they don’t have the water to grow their own. Or as Sam Kennison once said, “They don’t live where the food is!!”.
The bottom line is that the earth is finite. We must understand and identify the limits, become more prudent in our exploitation of resources, and in increasing our numbers. Consumption is likewise finite, and has its own limits.
It’s better to address these issues now, while we can, than wait until we hit the limits and have nowhere else to go.

I'm not following the train of logic that socialism causes overpopulation, but I'd certainly agree that it causes poverty and destruction for the common Joe. One only needs study the communist revolutions of Russia and China (among others) and tally the body count to see the destructive nature of such a philosophy.

To quote Dilbert "For every problem there is an engineering solution."

That solution will be found by people who want to find a solution - not those who simply wish to have what they are not willing to work to obtain.

Is that the problem of more people or of the government entities which restrict these people from gainful employment and education?

Take Africa for example. Were you aware that in the chocolate industry, African nations aren't permitted to export refined cocoa products like powder and the highly-coveted cocoa butter - both of which require processing plants and expertise. And who prevents them from developing these industries and everything which goes with them (infrastructure, education, jobs, etc.)? It is the European governments themselves!

If one goes back slightly in history to the Ethiopian hunger crisis of the 1980's, one quickly finds that the problem isn't arable land or water, but government corruption and war.

Let's examine the US agricultural industry. Were you aware that only 100 years ago the primary occupation of half the US was that of a farmer? Now only about 2% of the population is farmers yet they are so productive that we waste tons of food per year per person AND we export shiploads of grains and other products to other nations?

I'm not sure where you are getting your facts or your ideas, but we haven't even begun to hit the limits of sustainability of this planet. That being said, I filly support colonies on the Moon and on Mars as well as beyond.

It is a "harsh mistress" after all... ;)

Many of you miss the point. It’s not that there isn’t empty space, but much of that space is unusable for agriculture due to lack of water or other essentials.
When we don’t have enough rainfall in an area like much of the Great Plains, we pump water from the ground. That water comes from aquifers that contain what is called “fossil water” because it has taken millions of years for the earth to deposit the water there. These aquifers are not easily restored. When they’re gone, they’re gone. Then we have to rely on local rivers and rainfall. And the use of water will be demanded by all living along them, and water wars will ensue. That’s happening right now in California over the water from central and Northern California between the cities making up Greater Los Angeles, and agricultural interests in the agricultural valleys to the North
75% or so of earth's human population live within 40 miles of the earth’s coastline. They depend on the interiors of the continents for their daily bread.
I’m neither a Marxist or communist, and I’m not trying to tell Scary Stories. Scientific studies have shown that in nature, any organism or community will naturally grow and continue to grow until it outruns its food supply, at which point the population will crash, and major portions of the population will die. That’s fact.
The earth is finite, and likewise it’s ability to provide what humans need. THE EARTH IS LIMITED! We are already seeing huge pressure on resources. That pressure can only increase if we continue to add and add to our population. We cannot grow our population forever because of these limits. That, by definition, is unsustainably.

The notion of "sustainability" is a very slippery one, and needs precise use of language. An economy is neither a zero-sum game, nor does it stay static.

In a poor country, individuals overbreed because it's the only way to get supported in your old age in a country that doesn't have pensions/Social Security. Conversely, rich countries underbreed and wind up having to accept some immigrants (and teach them to behave) lest they be overrun in the next war that the overcrowded poor countries are forced by circumstance to start.

This kind of unproductive churning of civilizations has happened over and over, most of it (presumably) before recorded history because the history of a conquered country tends to get erased.

Real sustainability, then, requires that the rich countries breed -- and correctly bring up! -- a lot more people than they would want if they were alone in the world, and more than the individual citizens want. And it may also require that they use other methods, such as colonialism, to grow in both area/resources and population. Nations unwilling to do this will sooner or later disappear from history.

The "limits to growth" people would tell you that some indispensable natural resources are about to run out forever. But that has proven not to be true of oil (even if the earth isn't making it any more, and we don't know that!), and more importantly human ingenuity has always found us substitutes when previous generations' "indispensable resources" (for example, whale oil) ran short. There is no reason to think that will change for billions of years.

+1, DriveTrain, and would apply much more if I could.

I once thought I wanted to survive but now have given up on the idea...the parasitical humanoids have used our money to secure a place for themselves deep down under...

And that says something about Moon-, Mars-, or space-colony schemes.

The economics of settling the Moon are roughly the economics of settling Antarctica. Both are possible, but very expensive. The only way I see either happening is if somebody discovers big money to be made there. For instance, if the Antarctic were discovered to have a mother lode of oil, or even as much as the Arctic, somebody will settle there, even if they have to fight a war to do it.

I don’t believe for a second that adding more people is beneficial. The 5.5 million on the earth who earn less than the average worker in Mexico (go to NumbersUSA.com) add 84 million ppl to the world population each year. And where is the benefit? There is none! The actual result is more demand for resources like water, and more demand that groups like the UN, the USA, and other developed parts of the world send them more food and other supplies to support their larger populations.
This is not sustainable.

I’d as soon NOT be here for that, but you’re right!!

Too many Parasitical Humanoids and their useless idiots and not enought Consciously introspective Humans...they have us outnumbered 60/40

Ah, but they yet know of Natures Recycling of all time!...the 12 thousand year cycle and it's 1/2 cycle of which was Noah's Flood...the end of this cycle of civilization is Near...see suspicious0bservers.org...we've been studying this for years now and have causation and consequences....so use up all the resources you want...soon nature will recycle everything we've built.

As in where people actually live, or as in land that is used by people?

How much does a person need?

I’m with you. There are too many people. There are a plethora not contributing, and whining about other people having better phones and TVs. We are wasting gobs of resources keeping these people entertained.

There is no downside to fewer.

This thread is just packed with good ideas and thoughts. Thank you, Storo, for a splendid discussion. I hope it keeps going for days!

Well put!

Please insert the word "stupid" between many and people. ;-)

Kind of like all of North Korea at night. Communism works well for them.

Does this mean Biden can give up meeting UN's depopulation via vaccines? Do you realize we have heard the water shortage threat since i was in high school, decades ago. Some countries have addressed the desalination of sea water. Once we accept each by what he earns and stop the equatable cookie cutter existence, it would hlep create more producers. Actually, if the Earth magnetic poles would continue to switch, when they hit the Equator, all the disaster you descibe would happen, people or not. It is an Earth cycle, it has happened before. Ash, floods, volano eruptions, US divided in mid section by new waterway, then feet of packed ice. Ask the Chinese, they once went people into mountain tops to did out living quarters to survive.

I disagree. The problem is uneducated people that cannot feed themselves, and believe LIES they are told.

People STILL Believe that Meat/FAT leads to heart disease. That Obesity is NOT caused by ADDICTIVE Processed Foods.

Every segment of our system is corrupted. And people simply cannot see it. If you try to show them, they have been so dumbed down they cannot comprehend.

After that, yes, over-crowding. Which technology is starting to fix as people no longer have to work in cities to get jobs for those companies.

We are inside of a 4th turning. When we come out, it will be a different world.

the Blockchain, DAO system will allow people to align with like minded people regardless of geographic distance. And to share the benefits ONLY with those who belong, and supported the efforts. Cool stuff comes our way once SOME of this evil is removed!

I suggest we send them first.
And let them know that the Socialist Countries will immediately start shipping the Extra Oxygen they make in their Factories, Created by their Comrades working for FREE!

Julian Simon, in "The Ultimate Resource," proved for all time that adding more people is on net beneficial to the world economy. Anyone who still thinks the eco-nut movement has a point needs to read it.

The world's capacity to produce food sailed right on past its predicted end 20 years ago. The oil supply also continued to grow until fake president Biden shut down production on government land in the West. The next president needs to sell that land off so that no future president will be able to do that again.