Oh, I think they will get it, the optics of this charade are as bad as impeachment, Mueller, Russia, etc..all fails, in a 3 year period. I believe many will not vote demonrat this round...

I think trump is realizing that the dems only want to destroy the economy so they get stupid Biden as president. Not trump realizes that this bailout bill may never actually get passed, and its time to figure out how to get the economy back without the dems.

WHO is nothing more than an arm of the socialist UN. China was careless or calulating, but they caused it, and it is worth noting, Russia has only about 17 cases of the virus. Were thye warned to close their border with China even before Tump did no? Maybe this was a test run, or maybe it just turned out that way, but China is known for human abuse issues and does not follow rules of other countries about huanity.

Try this on, I would point you to the other sources tha have traced it back to a gorl who was delivering live virus to the Virus facility, but you would not give it any credit. However, being China, "real facts" are almost impossible to come by. So, we then have to rely on other data like:
1. no, or late reports.
2. False numbers.
3. Little to no communications with outside agencies to get help.
4. Valueing the Party's "face" more that humn lives.
5. Numerous anecdotal statements that they STILL have a problem,. they are just locking people in their buildings to die, a death unreported is a death that did not happen.
Why have a Level 4 facility in a city? What is it's purpose? This in a country that will militarize a roll of toilet paper, and who has already come out to threaten us with death in "the sea of coronavirus"?

https://www.theepochtimes.com/first-c...

Thanks, dogma is a tough nut to crack. Neither pragmatic or selfish are all good or bad.

Thank you, Thor, for a ray of reason here....

Yes, I have marvelled at that, too. I would be more worried about the end of freedom in America if it were the Dimocrats behind the effort. But since it is Trump, I will trust him for the 15 day "social distancing" period, then maybe a week after to see if the spread of the disease has been slowed. If the controls aren't lifted after that, I'll start to worry.

While it is just lovely that Ayn pointed out that individually being "selfish" to the exclusions of other is self defeating. We all here would agree.

It is quite another thing to take this argument to the scale of governments. If a government can develop adequate resources to take economic and military leadership, there nothing (except massive bloody revolution) to stop it.

The system Ayn describes in a free society among people and companies moderates itself. The inter political system of the world has very limited forms of moderation, and regimes, such as the one Ayn fled, exist for a long time with their "selfishness" un or weakly moderated by external influences.

You will have to come up with a better argument against this use of the word "selfish", than that Ayn used it in a positive manner. Unchecked with feedback it can quite obviously be negative, just as I described above.

None of that is evidence that they manufactured the virus. New viruses periodically occur naturally and are a constant threat. Corona virus is a kind of virus that was already known; this one is a new instance. The Chinese are secretive and hide all kinds of things by nature and blame the US for anything they can. All you can say is that they have the capacity for manufacturing germ warfare and as a dictatorship lack the scruples not to.

It makes sense to wonder if they did it, but not to "conclude" that they did it, let alone while believing you will never be able to prove it.

Those closer to the situation with more knowledge can try to investigate but have so far ruled it out. Whether or not you believe them depends on how much you know about them, etc.

Agreed

In the absence of conclusive proof, one can look to circumstantial observations:
1). There seems to be quite a number of “new” viruses that seem to originate in China
2) there is an experimental virus lab close to Wuhan
3) the Chinese response to the outbreak involved a lot of secrecy and hiding
4) the Chinese seemed to know a lot about the dna of this virus right away
5) the Chinese are blaming the USA for the virus

Please explain how Event 201 directly mirrors the actual events? Coincidence?

That is the opposite of any rational concept of self interest and contrary to everything Ayn Rand wrote and explained for a rational morality. "Selfish" does not mean a "motive" for dishonestly "hiding" to "maintain control and harming others". A snide "sorry" sneering at an alleged "preconceived answer" does not save it.

"This corona virus thing" is "part" of a "great big marketing firm for globalism"? A "World Bank" conspiracy somehow made a pandemic mysteriously "fortuitous" because of funding to combat spread of disease?" "Voila!"? A half hour of streaming batty conspiracies is not a credible source.

Selfish depends on the motive for the act. The acts were irresponsibility and hiding the event. Both harmed others. The motives were stupidity and control.

Hiding the event to maintain control and harming others is selfish. Sorry if that doesn't fit your preconceived answer.

Reckless irresponsibility leading to mass death is not selfish.

To say nothing of those who made it US policy to support and pander to China as it deliberately makes us dependent on it.

The requirement for evidence in accordance with logic is not a refusal to "deviate" from "swallowing" "lying fake media and WHO puppets" in a "main stream narrative".

Logic has been known to reject "narratives", including conspiracy theories from subjective speculation.

How do you conclude that with no proof and an acknowledgement that you will probably never have proof? Is there no such thing as a naturally evolving virus? Do they all require an evil creator to account for them under the latest theory of Virus Creationism?

No , as you say one must not deviate from the main stream narrative. Just swallow what these lying fake media and WHO puppets tell you.

https://youtu.be/IRJpP83MqNs

Our government is getting drunk with power made possible by the virus outbreak. Not that many people actually die, and destroying the economy here isnt going to cut the eventual death toll at all. But our government could destroy the dollar once and for all.....along with our economy

What China did was not different than a person with AIDS having unprotected sex with someone else. Ignorant or not, it is selfish and dangerous, compelling another to live with the potential consequences, without their consent.

China used force, whether or not they understood the consequences.

The chinese government is EVIL to the core. If this is what they wanted- to destroy the global economy, they are succeeding thanks to goverment reaction to the virus. By the time the virus has run its course, the USA economy, as well as many others, will be severely damaged.

China has taken a big PR hit over this, fotunately. I think as Americans we should slowly but with deliberate speed buy less from china, while keeping quiet about our plans.