Add Comment

FORMATTING HELP

All Comments Hide marked as read Mark all as read

  • 10
    Posted by Lucky 8 months, 1 week ago
    I think for myself. I am often in a minority. Some views are called conspiracy theories just because they are unpopular, against the current power structure or the flavor of the month of the chattering classes.

    So,
    (1) the idea that this virus was invented by/in the US, sent to China by military games competitors, for deliberate release, I see as possible (I am quite cynical sometimes).

    Put this idea up against:
    (2) There is a virus/bacterial lab in Wuhan (fact), that staff of the lab sell live animals after tests to 'wet markets' (very likely), the animals (bats, dogs, monkeys, rats) are eaten by many Chinese people (fact) who buy them alive from 'wet markets' as in Wuhan (fact). One or two, or many, of the animals sold still had the virus and it spread to many people going back to mid 2019 (likely), then one or two infected Wuhan people spread it rapidly (likely). Authorities, China and the UN WHO, knew about an outbreak of something bad and tried to suppress the news as well as the outbreak (fact). They failed on both (fact). Direct flights from Wuhan to N.Italy continued carrying hundreds of Wuhan factory workers especially at Chinese New Year time (Year of the rat, 25-Jan-2020) (fact).
    Go on from there, all very plausible or actual fact.

    My money is on (2) a million to one.
    Reply | Mark as read | Best of... | Permalink  
    • Posted by $ WilliamShipley 8 months, 1 week ago
      While it's possible that this was engineered, people looking at the genetics don't think so.

      Part of the speculation comes from the feeling that this is so bad it couldn't arise naturally from the region that most flues originate. That's nonsense, we've known that there was literally nothing that would prevent a Spanish Flu level pandemic from happening again.

      Yes we have better tools for testing and treating, but on the other hand we have so much better transportation. It has always been a possibility.
      Reply | Mark as read | Parent | Best of... | Permalink  
      • Posted by exceller 8 months, 1 week ago
        The genetic makeup of COVID-19 puzzled many scientists.

        The fact that they found HIV sequences in the virus RNA raises some questions.

        It is well known that the Chinese have been working on biowarfare research for a long time. A couple in Canada's top secret biowarfare lab have been arrested for divulging research results and supplying samples for the Chinese.

        I am flabbergasted as to why the conspiracy theorists are not concerned about that, instead trying to trace back the virus origins to the US and some obscure military covert operation?
        Reply | Mark as read | Parent | Best of... | Permalink  
      • Posted by $ blarman 8 months, 1 week ago
        Can you provide the links to your sources? The videos I've seen - from noted epidemiologists with access to the sequences - say that the genome points to deliberate manipulation. Even the mainstream media is reporting that over 70% of the virus is shared with SARS - a suspiciously high figure.
        Reply | Mark as read | Parent | Best of... | Permalink  
        • Posted by $ Flootus5 8 months, 1 week ago
          I saw 79% genetic affinity with SARS-CoV. 50% affinity with MERS-CoV. It was originally called SARS-CoV2 because of this close affinity. And then it was renamed CoVid-19, thereby removing any expectation of similar spread history as SARS-CoV. Which abated with warm weather.

          Can't let a good crisis go to waste!
          Reply | Mark as read | Parent | Best of... | Permalink  
    • Posted by Lucky 8 months, 1 week ago
      Add, N.Italy Milan is a big manufacturing center for the Italian fashion industry, hundreds of workers from China are employed.
      That is a stronger link than one cyclist at the games who works for a 4* NATO general.
      Reply | Mark as read | Parent | Best of... | Permalink  
      • Posted by $ 8 months, 1 week ago
        Yes that is correct. Those factories created the clothes for the atheletes. Could the closing ceremony uniforms be sprayed with the virus, and the infected then jet off to the hundred countries represented?
        Reply | Mark as read | Parent | Best of... | Permalink  
        • Posted by exceller 8 months, 1 week ago
          The virus does not survive on fabric. At least it has not been proven yet.

          It survives in aerosol droplets in the air and on metal/plastic surface for 2-3 days.
          Reply | Mark as read | Parent | Best of... | Permalink  
          • Posted by $ 8 months, 1 week ago
            Would drones flying over the stadium with 100,000 in attendance be able to spray aerosol droplets.
            One of the key figures that he is investigating actually does fly drones for large concerts. BTW their are 2 videos in this post.
            Also many different types of material in Fabric I would be surprised if you would use the same towel that an infected person used without being washed.
            Reply | Mark as read | Parent | Best of... | Permalink  
    • Posted by $ Abaco 8 months, 1 week ago
      I think it is possible that this is a product of a lab, most likely in Wuhan. Do I think a communist government would sponsor it? Sure. Do I think the American government would? Quite possibly. I don't know enough of the inside details to really form a strong position on it, though. I have seen a report on this virus that made it extremely unique if it's natural, including a report over a decade old that a virus like this was being developed in a lab - by the Chinese. Still...I need to really know before I'd put my chips on a theory. I'm an engineer. Therefore, I know a great deal about very little. Some things...I really know. I'm a hoot at your cocktail party (sarcasm)...
      Reply | Mark as read | Parent | Best of... | Permalink  
      • Posted by $ 8 months, 1 week ago
        JUSTICE NEWS

        Department of Justice
        Office of Public Affairs
        FOR IMMEDIATE RELEASE
        Tuesday, January 28, 2020
        Harvard University Professor and Two Chinese Nationals Charged in Three Separate China Related Cases

        The Department of Justice announced today that the Chair of Harvard University’s Chemistry and Chemical Biology Department and two Chinese nationals have been charged in connection with aiding the People’s Republic of China.

        Dr. Charles Lieber, 60, Chair of the Department of Chemistry and Chemical Biology at Harvard University, was arrested this morning and charged by criminal complaint with one count of making a materially false, fictitious and fraudulent statement. Lieber will appear this afternoon before Magistrate Judge Marianne B. Bowler in federal court in Boston, Massachusetts.

        Yanqing Ye, 29, a Chinese national, was charged in an indictment today with one count each of visa fraud, making false statements, acting as an agent of a foreign government and conspiracy. Ye is currently in China.

        Zaosong Zheng, 30, a Chinese national, was arrested on Dec. 10, 2019, at Boston’s Logan International Airport and charged by criminal complaint with attempting to smuggle 21 vials of biological research to China. On Jan. 21, 2020, Zheng was indicted on one count of smuggling goods from the United States and one count of making false, fictitious or fraudulent statements. He has been detained since Dec. 30, 2019.

        Dr. Charles Lieber

        According to court documents, since 2008, Dr. Lieber who has served as the Principal Investigator of the Lieber Research Group at Harvard University, which specialized in the area of nanoscience, has received more than $15,000,000 in grant funding from the National Institutes of Health (NIH) and Department of Defense (DOD). These grants require the disclosure of significant foreign financial conflicts of interest, including financial support from foreign governments or foreign entities. Unbeknownst to Harvard University beginning in 2011, Lieber became a “Strategic Scientist” at Wuhan University of Technology (WUT) in China and was a contractual participant in China’s Thousand Talents Plan from in or about 2012 to 2017. China’s Thousand Talents Plan is one of the most prominent Chinese Talent recruit plans that are designed to attract, recruit, and cultivate high-level scientific talent in furtherance of China’s scientific development, economic prosperity and national security. These talent programs seek to lure Chinese overseas talent and foreign experts to bring their knowledge and experience to China and reward individuals for stealing proprietary information. Under the terms of Lieber’s three-year Thousand Talents contract, WUT paid Lieber $50,000 USD per month, living expenses of up to 1,000,000 Chinese Yuan (approximately $158,000 USD at the time) and awarded him more than $1.5 million to establish a research lab at WUT. In return, Lieber was obligated to work for WUT “not less than nine months a year” by “declaring international cooperation projects, cultivating young teachers and Ph.D. students, organizing international conference[s], applying for patents and publishing articles in the name of” WUT.

        The complaint alleges that in 2018 and 2019, Lieber lied about his involvement in the Thousand Talents Plan and affiliation with WUT. On or about, April 24, 2018, during an interview with investigators, Lieber stated that he was never asked to participate in the Thousand Talents Program, but he “wasn’t sure” how China categorized him. In November 2018, NIH inquired of Harvard whether Lieber had failed to disclose his then-suspected relationship with WUT and China’s Thousand Talents Plan. Lieber caused Harvard to falsely tell NIH that Lieber “had no formal association with WUT” after 2012, that “WUT continued to falsely exaggerate” his involvement with WUT in subsequent years, and that Lieber “is not and has never been a participant in” China’s Thousand Talents Plan.

        Should this be investigated? I’m just saying as you have eluded too that you have “secrets” that would be damning if known by US. I would expect you would applaud efforts to find the real facts to uncover the truth.
        https://www.justice.gov/opa/pr/harvar...
        Reply | Mark as read | Parent | Best of... | Permalink  
        • Posted by $ Abaco 8 months ago
          No. I don't have secrets that would be damning to the US in particular. Not sure what that means, actually. But, I find that post very interesting, and not surprising.
          Reply | Mark as read | Parent | Best of... | Permalink  
    • Posted by $ rainman0720 8 months, 1 week ago
      I won't take that bet. And I never put 2 and 2 together, that the Chinese were selling off their lab animals after they were done experimenting.

      And I'm with something term2 commented about on a different topic today: The genetic makeup of this virus was mapped out very, very quickly. Perhaps a bit too quickly.
      Reply | Mark as read | Parent | Best of... | Permalink  
  • Posted by $ Abaco 8 months, 1 week ago
    I got about 12 minutes in. This is typical of these conspiracy theorists....just rambling on and on naming names and speculating. But, it's all sizzle and no steak. OK...he "goes places" and knows the names of some of the workers there. That's nice.
    Reply | Mark as read | Best of... | Permalink  
    • Posted by freedomforall 8 months, 1 week ago
      👍
      Reply | Mark as read | Parent | Best of... | Permalink  
      • Posted by $ 8 months, 1 week ago
        A person(s) value:
        1. vote
        2. monetary value (tax contribution)
        3.
        Why is 'free thought' ridiculed, challenged, and threatened when a person is opposed to the 'mainstream-narrative'?
        [2] remains fixed (degree allowable by 'economic recession/expansion')
        [1] remains a variable
        [1] dependent on a 'controlled' system of information dissemination
        What happens when 90% of the media is controlled/owned by (6) corporations?
        What happens when those same corporations are operated and controlled by a political ideology?
        What happens when the news is no longer free from bias?
        What happens when the news is no longer reliable and independent?
        What happens when the news is no longer trustworthy?
        What happens when the news simply becomes an extension/arm of a political party?
        Fact becomes fiction?
        Fiction becomes fact?
        When does news become propaganda?
        Identity creation?
        How does the average person, who is under constant financial stress (by design), find time to research and discern fact v fiction?
        Majority of people more prone to believe someone in power sitting behind a big brand ‘news’ name?
        Do people [human psyche] tend to follow the ‘majority/mainstream viewpoint’ in fear of being isolated and/or shunned?
        ‘Mainstream’ is used for a reason [dominate trend in opinion].
        [If majority of people believe ‘x’ then ‘x’ must be validated / true]
        Why do ‘mainstream’ media heads, within different orgs, always use the same keywords and/or catch phrases?
        Coordinated? By who? Outside entity providing instructions?
        Do they count on the fact that people [human psyche] are more prone to believe something if heard over-and-over again by different ‘trusted’ sources?
        Do ‘echo chamber’ tactics provide validation / credibility to the topic/point being discussed?
        Threat to intellectual freedom?
        Would control over[of] these institutions/organizations allow for the mass control of a populations viewpoint re: a desired topic?
        Read again – digest.
        Reply | Mark as read | Parent | Best of... | Permalink  
    • Posted by bobsprinkle 8 months, 1 week ago
      I only got about 6 minutes into this talking head.
      Reply | Mark as read | Parent | Best of... | Permalink  
      • -2
        Posted by $ 8 months, 1 week ago
        Ok , many have short attention spans. If you want an encapsulated talking point. Some fuQheads are trying to save their asses from certain punishment
        and weaponized a virus to get rid of their enemy President Donald J Trump when all their other schemes failed. They never thought she would lose.
        Reply | Mark as read | Parent | Best of... | Permalink  
        • Posted by $ Abaco 8 months ago
          Yeah, we don't need the insult, really. Some of us are so busy working that we are highly selective in our viewing of different things. If I get 12 minutes in and it's still all sizzle and no steak, I'm out. Maybe this guy nails it and I just didn't get to it. But, don't need the insult. Doesn't help anything.
          Reply | Mark as read | Parent | Best of... | Permalink  
          • Posted by $ 8 months ago
            First of all. I was not talking to you. I was responding to “I got 6 mins in.....it’s a 28 min report. So with his Quick judgement he obviously didn’t have time or patience...hence my summary.
            I am also busy with two jobs. My time is a valuable as yours is. If you don’t have time to listen how do you have time to judge my post or the information contained in it. If you can refute what he says in a short time, thats fine have at it.
            By the way you called him a conspiracy theorist. Is that what a real investigative journalist is? Asking what happened just prior to the most disrupting world event in my life only makes sense. Asking what happened to the 22 stolen vials of virus from the BioWare fare lab in Canada Stolen by 2 Dr.s one an HIV expert and the other SARS corona . Tracking the first Corona virus case and who was she connected to. Who has diplomatic advantage for transporting this kind of material? These are important things to look into if you actually want to get to the bottom of it all.
            Reply | Mark as read | Parent | Best of... | Permalink  
    • Posted by $ 8 months, 1 week ago
      Oh I get it to many names and connections to Wuhan are not worth looking into .Your right he should have been following these people with a camera and cought them in the act otherwise , It hurts the stupid Chinese people eating foul Bats
      Narrative and from that it just exploded worldwide. Hmm BTW any Question unless you know the answer begins with speculation. Kind of like “Are vaccines causing a lot of Autism in today’s children”? Or how bout this one. “Did Oswald act alone” ?
      Pure speculation right.
      Reply | Mark as read | Parent | Best of... | Permalink  
      • Posted by $ Abaco 8 months, 1 week ago
        I didn't get into it very far. But, I hope he used reason - pointing out at least that there is incentive to conflict of interest.

        I know stuff that I'm pretty sure could get me killed. I've shared it with very few and it always hits them like a sledgehammer. But, I use hard science in my knowledge. The stories of the people clearly profiting by covering stuff up is just icing on the cake.
        Reply | Mark as read | Parent | Best of... | Permalink  
  • Posted by exceller 8 months, 1 week ago
    OK, so the Chinese are white and innocent as lilies. I see. They have nothing to do with COVID-19.

    Blows the mind how far imagination reaches...

    Did these erstwhile gentlemen consider that the only top secret biowarfare lab on land is in Wuhan, China? All the others are offshore.

    The Chines are notorious regarding poor containment practices. I think the likelihood of the lab releasing the virus carries more water than some phantasy about 300 athletes who did not perform well.

    The Chinese gov is hunting for fake info like this. They already fished out some Facebook notes of a woman in Seattle who claimed the virus was around before China had it. She could not prove it, it was all speculation, but it suited the purpose of the Chinese. I bet this video will appear soon on the official Chinese party website, proving that it was the US who initiated it.
    Reply | Mark as read | Best of... | Permalink  
    • Posted by $ Olduglycarl 8 months, 1 week ago
      Who's to say that the chinese scientist were in on this...deep state connections?...black hats are black hats no matter where they come from or whom the collude with.
      Reply | Mark as read | Parent | Best of... | Permalink  
      • Posted by $ 8 months, 1 week ago
        Nobody is giving Chinese government a pass , I agree The evil knows no borders. Funny how investigating who was around and what was happening is attacked. The fact remains that there was a large contingent of atheletes at Wuhan just before Covid release. One hundred thousand people flew out after the closing ceremonies to 100 countries. The first case was a cyclist from Milan Who happened to be a courier to a 4* NATO General. Milan is the current epicenter. A brother who Oh yes married to Kolomoisky’s daughter. The Same Ukrainian Kolomoisky that had the phony black ledger on Paul Manafort.. you would think that maybe that’s worth looking into? Or the Two Drs husband and wife who were caught after 23 vials of from the Canadian facility went missing.
        Ozcams Razor or something like that.
        Reply | Mark as read | Parent | Best of... | Permalink  
        • Posted by $ Olduglycarl 8 months, 1 week ago
          I was responding to exceller. I agree with you and the information we have found. At the least, we have an answer as to how All 5 types of CV ended up here in the USA. We can also see that, perhaps a number of labs have looked at, if not further manipulated the virus but I think it's pretty clear that the initial outbreak came out of china...at the very least, for the virus showing up in Italy and Iran...the rest seems to be attributed to the nature of human travels around the world and I am sure, some of that was "On Purpose".
          Reply | Mark as read | Parent | Best of... | Permalink  
        • Posted by freedomforall 8 months, 1 week ago
          The issue is not that it shouldn't be investigated.
          The issue is that the messenger doesn't organize the message rationally and it is incomprehensible. Hopefully someone else will be able to sort it out and independently verify fact to support or refute the speculation.
          Reply | Mark as read | Parent | Best of... | Permalink  
          • Posted by term2 8 months, 1 week ago
            I agree, this message just rambled on and on, making it hard to decipher. In the absence of more factual information, however, I have concluded that one or more government labs is responsible for making this virus and at least letting it out somehow. Kind of like that Stephen King movie I think was called the MIST
            Reply | Mark as read | Parent | Best of... | Permalink  
        • Posted by exceller 8 months, 1 week ago
          This speculation is a coincidence, at best.

          Did these "whistleblowers" look into the possibility that the virus was released by the Wuhan lab at the same time or thereabout?

          There are many conspiracy theories out there.

          Providing China with a weapon to deny their culpability is not helping anything.
          Reply | Mark as read | Parent | Best of... | Permalink  
  • Posted by Lucky 8 months, 1 week ago
    Blame Bats
    https://www.spectator.co.uk/article/W...

    Some quotes from Ridley's article:
    From bats: Rabies. Ebola. Marburg. Hendra. Nipah. Sars. Mers. etc.
    "Why are bats responsible for so many .... ?"

    ".. it seems bats probably did not give us Covid-19 directly. The virus’s sequence of RNA (DNA’s cousin) in human beings is 96 per cent the same as that found in a bat sampled in Yunnan in 2013 .."

    "It took years to sequence the genome of HIV, weeks to sequence the genome of Sars and days for Covid-19."
    This should be taken as good news.

    " . stop bringing wild animals into markets alive (if at all): viruses do not survive long in dead bodies, even if not refrigerated. It’s a cruel practice anyway. And second, let’s keep our distance from bats. Definitely don’t eat them."
    Several other posts here say the same thing.

    My comment:
    A good article on the way evolution works.
    This article puts a damper on the deliberate creation conspiracy theory.

    Author Matt Ridley hosts the website
    http://www.rationaloptimist.com/
    small government, libertarian, conservative (small c), optimist
    Reply | Mark as read | Best of... | Permalink  
  • Posted by exceller 8 months, 1 week ago
    This is what I was referring to, regarding the CCP concocting fake information based upon speculative sources in the US and elsewhere:

    https://www.theepochtimes.com/china-u...

    “The study listed several known hacked accounts, such as a professor in North Carolina, a college student at the University of Nebraska Omaha, a web designer in the United Kingdom, and a business analyst in Australia.”

    “OneSight, a Beijing-based internet marketing company with connections to the Chinese regime, announced the launch of a new app that would track virus-related information, and help “transmit the correct voice of China” to the world.”

    “The company’s CEO previously worked at the Beijing city foreign propaganda department. Its clients include state media outlets and regime-friendly firms like Huawei and Alibaba.”
    Reply | Mark as read | Best of... | Permalink  
  • Posted by term2 8 months, 1 week ago
    WOW. I dont have access to much information on this virus and its spread, but it sure does seem to me that a government screwup is involved somehow.

    I dont think any government should be messing with the weaponizing of viruses EVER, and I dont have enough information to blame any government today for this Kung flu virus, but it is very suspicious.
    Reply | Mark as read | Best of... | Permalink  

FORMATTING HELP

  • Comment hidden. Undo