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  • Posted by richrobinson 10 years, 6 months ago
    Should I laugh or cry. How could they not get the Nazi Germany reference?
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    • Posted by khalling 10 years, 6 months ago
      maybe they're all dehydrated or something
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      • Posted by richrobinson 10 years, 6 months ago
        It just seems so obvious. Do they really want a police state? Even with the sorry state of education today how could you not know anything associated with Nazi Germany is most likely evil.
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        • Posted by LetsShrug 10 years, 6 months ago
          It must be getting glazed over in school...either that or younger people have zero concept of what it was really like OR that it really did happen (and could happen again)....you have to read more than a few pages about Nazis for it to sink in.... and how many would voluntarily seek out more reading OR movies on the topic when they have so many other things to occupy their minds....like facebook and twerking. (Not that these petition signers were all that "young"..)... people are idiots...it's frightening! Everyday is halloween anymore...I'm not decorating my house like I usually do....or giving out candy to moochers either. I might put up a sign that says, "Obamanomics stole my candy money. Thanks for voting." (My student's parents will love that I'm sure.)
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          • Posted by RogerMalcolm 10 years, 6 months ago
            You're hilarious. I know I studied Nazi Germany myself after my father made a comment to me about never forgetting our history when I was young. It became an obsession like many things do for me. So much to a point I've had friends accusing me of being a Nazi for my research. Ignorance has always plagued my peers, so I don't see how any other generation would inform themselves anymore than mine. I'm just an exception. Always have been and always will be. Though even my mom yelled and threatened me to stop reading about Hitler/Nazis when I was young.

            Of course of all people I know, I'm the only one to visit a concentration camp. I went to Sachsenhausen-Oranienburg while I was in Berlin. I visited train tracks with grates engraved with dates and number of Juden(Jews) per trainload. They were hidden and hard to find but they were there. At the time I was dating an English girl, she had informed her friends of my interest. So the first time I met them, they asked me what was up with my interest in Hitler. I was shocked and thought why the hell is that the opening comment. I informed them I have always been intrigued by a political party's ability to turn an entire country against their neighbors. It satisfied them I suppose.

            It has been the reactions from others that have enlightened me the most. I suppose the horrible atrocities are so severe or surreal that it is basically taboo for them to even address. Though my opinion is that the English are far more indoctrinated than Americans. Now that's really a scary thought. Yet, I even had an American place a "Say No to Nazis" sticker on my door while I lived in Germany. It's just very disheartening to have friends and family know me yet treat me as if I am something I'm not just because I had taken the time to educate myself. The one thing that struck me the most was gutters being filled with Deutsch Marks, yet no one bothered to pick them up because of the inflation. I read that in 7th grade. I honestly didn't fully understand it of course back then but sadly I understand it all too well now. If only everyone educated themselves.

            To close, I love this site. I love the folks that share their views on this site and I love the intelligence and knowledge being shared for me to absorb.
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            • Posted by LetsShrug 10 years, 6 months ago
              Thanks Roger :)... Funny how there IS a difference between people who seek to educate themselves (because they have questions....we want to "why!?" so we LOOK for answers) and people who just don't pay attention to anything outside of their own happy bubble. I wish I could walk around with a really big pin...and POP them awake!
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              • Posted by RogerMalcolm 10 years, 6 months ago
                Me too! I try and I do believe my behaviour must have some kind of impact cause I've been attacked a lot for the way I am. I just hope one day the people I've interacted with will one day wake up because I helped in some small way. It's perhaps greed but I would love for everyone to be free individuals.
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                • Posted by LetsShrug 10 years, 6 months ago
                  Yes...I am hoping the same thing, but crimony, their obliviousness gets exhausting. You gave me an idea... "Free individuals". Maybe that could be a conversation starter..."what does being a 'free individual' mean to you?" Honestly, though, I don't think most people can even explain freedom coherently. They think it's related to the gov granting them something.
                  Do share your conversations with us. We love those. :)
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                  • Posted by RogerMalcolm 10 years, 6 months ago
                    I shall try it from now on. Most of the time when discussing anything with others I always end up thinking about Thomas Paine's comment towards General William Howe from The American Crisis: "To argue with a man who has renounced the use and authority of reason, and whose philosophy consists in holding humanity in contempt, is like administering medicine to the dead, or endeavoring to convert an atheist by scripture."
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            • Posted by richrobinson 10 years, 6 months ago
              Great post Roger. Have you ever asked anyone why they don't want to know about Nazi Germany? I always find it enlightening when I find someone who has thoroughly researched a subject. I ask as many questions as I can. That being said I would like to hear more about the concentration camp you visited. Was it emotional? What was the reaction of others that were there?
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              • Posted by RogerMalcolm 10 years, 6 months ago
                "I always find it enlightening when I find someone who has thoroughly researched a subject. I ask as many questions as I can."

                I've always annoyed people at being this way. I had a boss ask me one night: "If you are so interested in all this history why don't you just research it yourself?" My answer was because he had majored in History at Indiana University. I believe that was where his degree was from. Since I was working for him at his Drive-In Musillami's why wouldn't I take the time to discuss history with him. I'll never really understand why it was a problem to discuss such things. It's not like it took away from my work. I know this because he once told my father, whom he had worked with at Burger Chef in the seventies, that I had performed my job better than any other individual that had ever worked there. It was a huge compliment even though it was a burger joint, especially since it was established in the fifties. Though he did recommend The Imperial War Museum in London, England because of my interest and it was a cool experience when I got the opportunity to visit it.

                As for Sachsenhausen, it was located on the outskirts of the town from the far end of where the tracks ended for the train/tram. It was a hot sunny day in August 2004, we had to walk a very long distance to even find it. When we got there it had very few visitors but a couple of people were inside tending to the museum area. As for the others at the camp, no one was chipper. I never was overcome with strong emotions. At least not compared to my reaction after meeting Clive Doyle, Sheila Martin and other Branch Davidian survivors of the Waco siege in 2012. Though that consisted of interviewing them for hours and eating dinner several times before it hit me. I did however take my time to absorb as much as I could from within the walls of the camp. Actually the train tracks I found seemed to impact me more. I was alone besides my girlfriend at the time who stood at the entrance not interested. I am only one person but I don't know or understand how anyone could not feel something from such atrocities. The tracks were hidden mostly by the foliage. I took many photos in black and white with my 35mm Nikon. I love the photos but they did come out haunting.

                I also located the spot where Hitler's underground bunker is with the apartment complex and playground sitting on top of it. I'm not 100% positive it was the place but all my directions led me to a place that was describe in that way. The Check Point Charlie Museum in Berlin was an eye opener as well. The innovations people made attempting to escape the city was truly astounding.

                All of this because my father drew a small swastika on a tank when I was young and my mother got upset. So he explained it to me and said the infamous words of "never forget our history." My father was in a severe motorcycle accident in 2007. I'm no longer able to communicate with him like I would like, so I hold on tight to the things he did that made me better.
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                • Posted by LetsShrug 10 years, 6 months ago
                  Okay...so that made me cry!.. mostly the last paragraph. :( Smart man, yer Dad.

                  (ps why doesn't Waco and Ruby Ridge get brought up more? And what's with having a degree in history and NOT wanting to talk history to someone who's asking?! Holy hell! I know one person who visited a concentration camp...she talked about the fenced in wall of shoes. :( )
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                • Posted by richrobinson 10 years, 6 months ago
                  I have a customer who was a history major in college. His brother in law told me never to bring it up cause he wouldn't stop talking. I told him I enjoy talking about that stuff. Sometimes on rainy days when things are slow he comes in just so we can talk politics and history. I would have to think I would be moved just to be at the site where all this happened. Thanks for the post Roger. Very sorry about your dad.
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          • Posted by richrobinson 10 years, 6 months ago
            I was just talking to a young man who works for us. He graduated last year and said they had an entire section devoted to Nazi Germany. They also watched the movie "The boy in the striped pajamas". The son of a concentration camp commandant befriends a Jewish boy at the camp who tells him what is going on inside. At least some know whats going on.
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            • Posted by LetsShrug 10 years, 6 months ago
              I've read that book. :( (Did he tell you the son 'borrows' the boys 'pajamas'...trades clothes...the jewish boy escapes...the other boy not so lucky.) Wait..I hope I'm remembering this story correctly...my memory sucks. Something like that anyway... heart wrencher.
              Good to know something is being taught... I wonder about inner city schools. When there's a ton of behavioral disruptions happening hardly any learning gets absorbed....and the kids just keep getting pushed to the next grade regardless of achievements. Also...I think, when Nazi German is being studied, they should get into the philosophy of the people more at that time. I just recently learned about it myself...once you learn where they were at, philosophy wise, you no longer ask "why didn't they do something....why didn't they question authority?"
              It's this conditioned mentality of removing logic...not expecting things to make sense....that the leaders are to be trusted and that they know what's best...(go ahead, take my guns away, it will keep us safer from thieves..)... the 'right' ideas that were pumped into the propaganda changed daily, sometimes conflicting the previous days information... no one questioned it. (I see the same thing happening here... no one sees, no one notices and no one questions....and no one judges....) (Ominous Parallels...Leonard Peikoff.) (Common core removes logic and replaces it with emotional teaching instead.... see why I hate it?) If I'm being repetitious..I'm sorry.
              And sorry for the rant.
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  • Posted by LionelHutz 10 years, 6 months ago
    I am absolutely certain the majority of people will sign any petition you put in front of them, and that even those that might have waited to hear him out before signing got on board the moment he uttered the word "Police".
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