13

Get It Right, by Robert Gore

Posted by straightlinelogic 8 years, 8 months ago to Economics
18 comments | Share | Flag

The received wisdom before last week’s US stock market plunge was that China’s economic and financial problems would remain local. After the plunge, the revised received wisdom is that it’s all China’s fault. Neither analysis is correct. China has entered a debt contraction after one of the greatest, if not the greatest, debt expansions in history. Its problems are exacerbated by its lack of freedom and its command and control government (they’re communists, after all), which stands revealed as unable to dictate economic outcomes. It has its fingers crossed that its inability does not cross over into the political realm, probably a vain hope.

The US has entered the same debt contraction phase as China—just a few months later—after a debt expansion that dates back to the 1960’s, when Presidents Johnson and Nixon opted for guns and butter on the installment plan. Nixon cut the last fiscal tether to reality in 1971 when he closed the gold window. The US’s problems will not be solved by the command and control ministrations and manipulations of its government and central bank, any more than China’s have been.

Governments and central banks are the problem, not the solution. The market-based solutions of debt contraction, asset repricing, insolvency, bankruptcy, reorganization, economic contraction, reduced consumption, and unemployment are not planks of a platform designed to win next year’s US election or quell Chinese unrest. They will, however, happen regardless of who’s running things in either nation. The one certainty is that the powers that be in both nations will make matters worse.

This is an excerpt. The rest of the article can be accessed by the link above.
SOURCE URL: http://straightlinelogic.com/2015/08/23/get-it-right-by-robert-gore/


Add Comment

FORMATTING HELP

All Comments Hide marked as read Mark all as read

  • Posted by BrettRocketSci 8 years, 8 months ago
    Thanks for the article! Seems obvious to me we are in a combination of major bubbles that have to pop in a nasty fashion. Looks like the start of a chain reaction now.
    Reply | Mark as read | Best of... | Permalink  
  • Posted by CircuitGuy 8 years, 8 months ago
    “The received wisdom before last week’s US stock market plunge was that China’s economic and financial problems would remain local.”
    Who made that claim?

    “At the first hint that the rate won’t be raised we’ll see one of those one- or two-day wonder rallies that crucify the shorts. In the long run, it will be an almost imperceptible upward squiggle on a stock chart”
    This claim is true at any time. Financial articles speculate and wring their hands over monetary policy decisions not because they matter so much but because they're easy. We know when decisions are coming and when the sealed deliberations will be released a few months later. It doesn't mean that's important information for investors.

    “For those who are prepared and who get it right intellectually, there will be comic, even hilarious, moments.”
    You could look at it that way. I remember listening to commentators at age 12 after the Oct 1987 crash. Something happened in the financial markets that supposedly shocked the adults of the world. I listened to some of it in the recession of '91, which I recall as more like prolonged whining that lasted five years. When I got my degree in engineering and made money with incentive options, I believed the world had changed. We were creating something that would end war and the nation state, and blow away previous valuation models. It was early 2001 sitting in a bar on a business trip watching financial news that I realized how wrong I was. The recession of '01 caused about 20% of my colleagues in the electronics world to leave the industry. I remember hearing people saying the world as we know it coming to and end. I had heard that before after the crash of '87 and the recession of '91. Eventually the recovery got under way. I sold my condo in '04 for twice what I paid for it and rented a decently nice house all through the recession of 08-09. Histronics hit a fever pitch when my first son was born in '08, and it occurred to me then that people were probably going equally ape during the recession of '75 when I was born. I remember laughing about it and filming my wife rocking our first baby to song Disturbia. We joked we were capturing a bit of the zeitgeist of his infancy. I guess it was like Network when I was baby. Where coming up on ten years after the last recession. Our investments from those times have doubled. For the past few years, with a few exceptions, we've found it easier to get customers and easier to raise prices. So I predict a serious of rate hikes and major hand-wringing and histrionics. It has to get to that point before we even begin to solve problems like the fiscal deficit. I'm confident we will, but it only comes after we after to raise rates to control inflation and long-term rates are too high to allow us to borrow our way out of it as in the stagflation when I was baby. Lots of bellyaching will be forthcoming. I guess I agree the best approach is to laugh. I'll just turn off the news and turn on some Pearl Jam and pretend like it's the recession of '91.
    Reply | Mark as read | Best of... | Permalink  
    • Posted by 8 years, 8 months ago
      Unfortunately, it won't be.
      Reply | Mark as read | Parent | Best of... | Permalink  
      • Posted by CircuitGuy 8 years, 8 months ago
        I think it will be like the recession of 01-02. Right now we're in 1999, but pushing much harder on the fiscal and monetary gas pedals.
        https://youtu.be/p47fEXGabaY
        Reply | Mark as read | Parent | Best of... | Permalink  
        • Posted by 8 years, 8 months ago
          I think it will be like the depression of 1929-1940, only worse. This will be the bust to the greatest and longest-running global credit boom in history.
          Reply | Mark as read | Parent | Best of... | Permalink  
          • Posted by CircuitGuy 8 years, 8 months ago
            "I think it will be like the depression of 1929-1940"
            Except people with stuff to trade can use Bitcoin or foreign currencies. People with wealth to invest and people with good ideas that require investment can come together in other ways. The national banks and financial institutions think they're the source of the one thing that allows people to trade without mutual coincidence of wants. If they can't manage it right, though, people will find alternatives much more quickly than they could in the days when you could buy a news paper in one city, get on a train, and sell it at your destination to people wanting news from another city.
            Reply | Mark as read | Parent | Best of... | Permalink  
          • Posted by teri-amborn 8 years, 8 months ago
            Probably...
            BUT remember: 1929 - 1940 was before birth control and legalized abortion as well as so many "military-industrial complex" endless nonsensical wars of attrition.

            You need people to create supply-and-demand. "Credit" is a mortgage on the future. If there is no future, then there is no need for mortgaging it.

            Frankly, I think that we are doomed...mostly because of lack of a long-term philosophical view of life.
            Reply | Mark as read | Parent | Best of... | Permalink  
  • Posted by ObjectiveAnalyst 8 years, 8 months ago
    Hello Staightlinelogic,
    I know one does not like to be the harbinger of bad news. :( Sooner or later these policies must end badly. The most unfortunate thing is that the more bandaids and short term solutions that do not address the underlying bad economics only portend a more devastating outcome.
    As I write this the market is down another 347.85... for those with retirement funds relying on the market this must be terrifying.
    Respecfuly,
    O.A.
    Reply | Mark as read | Best of... | Permalink  
    • Posted by 8 years, 8 months ago
      It will get more terrifying. As I have been saying for some time, and I know you have been paying attention, the whole global debt-based financial system is unsustainable, and that which is unsustainable will ultimately not be sustained.
      Reply | Mark as read | Parent | Best of... | Permalink  
  • Posted by $ jbrenner 8 years, 8 months ago
    Normally I agree with you, straightlinelogic. I think I need a little explanation here. How is the US entering a debt contraction? The government is still spending more than it takes in, even if one doesn't count what is "off the books". Is personal debt actually going down? From what I had seen on nerdwallet.com, personal debt had gone up a little this year. I am actually looking forward to a debt contraction in the US, but I don't think I'll see one.
    Reply | Mark as read | Best of... | Permalink  
    • Posted by 8 years, 8 months ago
      High yield debt spreads, especially in natural resource debt, have dramatically widened and companies are going bankrupt. The stock market is cracking. The economy is slowing dramatically, and if it is not in a recession, it will soon be. Debt is clearly at the point where additional debt is, if not a negative, at best a break even proposition (I would argue, and have, that the marginal value of debt is now negative). All of these are harbingers of debt contraction, and if we are not yet "officially" in a debt contraction, we soon will be. If you wait for the statistics to tell you what's going on, you'll always be a day late and many dollars short.
      Reply | Mark as read | Parent | Best of... | Permalink  
    • Posted by term2 8 years, 8 months ago
      I think that we dont get the straight scoop on what the federal reserve is doing. Something is definitely UP though. Today the Dow crashed and then recovered somewhat- but what happened in china is GOOD for us in that we buy so much from china, our costs will go down !!
      Reply | Mark as read | Parent | Best of... | Permalink  
      • Posted by 8 years, 8 months ago
        The declining price of goods from China, and other nations that export to the US and have competitively devalued their currencies, is but one of many signs of gathering deflation, which is the most visible sign of contracting debt.
        Reply | Mark as read | Parent | Best of... | Permalink  
        • Posted by term2 8 years, 8 months ago
          This stuff is so complicated and interrelated, its hard for me to understand. Why would we have deflation now when our fed and the others are in high speed money printing mode. Shouldnt there be INflation? Or is there inflation, but hidden by greater deflation for other reasons like a hidden depression? I just got price concessions from china on the parts we buy for our business, so my profits will go up this year.
          Reply | Mark as read | Parent | Best of... | Permalink  
          • Posted by 8 years, 8 months ago
            The link below is to a long article I published on SLL last November, "The Economics of Debt, Deterioration, Deflation, Depression, and Disorder." This stuff is nowhere near as complicated as people try to make it, but there are fundamental differences between debt and money that often obscure the intellectual analysis. I think the article will clarify some things for you, including why "printing money" has not led to inflation. In conjunction with a newsletter that I will soon launch, I plan to publish an ebook on my mode of economic analysis. I will test it on my 78-year-old mother for readability and understandability. I have set myself a page limit of no more than 40 pages (and It should be appreciably shorter than that).

            http://straightlinelogic.com/2014/11/...
            Reply | Mark as read | Parent | Best of... | Permalink  

FORMATTING HELP

  • Comment hidden. Undo