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The idea is based on the Israeli program of active interaction with airline passengers. Political correctness prevents us from being effective.
Coming down in favor of either the ACLU or the TSA makes me feel like I do when a liberal friend who knows my philosophy and politics tries to "wind me up" as the Brits say by asking questions like "Who would you rather have as President: Obama or Hillary?"
I haven't flown literally in years so I have no experience personally with the TSA, although I've heard the usual horror stories.
Imy only thoughts at this point are that I would hope they have some kind of intelligent screening program, and I would have no problem with some kind of "profiling" if it works. I just don't know.
If that's the case, it would certainly negate the program for the ACLU to succeed and make the screening protocols public.
What say others?
Furthermore, you have also reminded me that those closest to the situation, the airlines themselves, should rightfully take responsibility for the safety of their passengers, and are without question in a better position to do that effectively than a government agency. It would be unfortunate should it occur, but I would doubt that an airline that was lax in security, leading to a terrorist incident where they were clearly, objectively negligent, would not survive in the marketplace.
That would provide a market-based incentive that would pretty well clear the skies of passenger-terrorist risks.
And it would probably start out with draconian levels and then back down to 'strict' when the effectiveness of the screening proved to the Insurance Underwriters that the airlines were using effective techniques and policies.
I'd kind of bet that the Israeli carriers already have LOTS of useful data and experience in this field.
I've half-jokingly suggested that the US could shut down the TSA altogether and 'simply' outsource the entire 'security delivery system' to Israel's teams.
Whatever... Shit, I'm 'just an engineer'... what could I possibly know?
:)
Also....Not Voting at all is called Under Vote. A large percentage is not a good thing for the so called winners who cannot at this time get a majority only a plurality as a result. I''d like the under vote to exceed fifty percent. A sure sign of being on the road to recovery assuming that voting exists in the future.
Jan
"Who would you rather have in front of a firing squad: Obama or Hillary?"
If the choice were mine and effectively immediately, I'd choose to save this country more short-term grief. The former.
Too bad they're not Republicans...then they'd take each other out in the circular firing squad...
That's quite a vision ;^)
I propose we the people defund the ammunition for all of them.
Thank you for that image.
Jan
That said, why not leave the safety issues to the individual airlines, who have the most to lose if terrorism is allowed to occur?? Its their planes, their passengers, and their ability to attract passengers in the future at stake. If it was MY airline, I would want control over who I let on my airplanes, not some TSA motivated by bureaucracy. We are letting the airlines off the hook, by allowing them to say "it wasnt my fault, the TSA let the passenger on the plane...." and shift the blame. Maybe we should at least subcontract airline safety to the Israelis. They seem to be able to prevent airplane terrorism pretty well. I have to laugh at the TSA making me remove my belt and shoes and putting me through pat-downs and all- I am 69 years old, cant walk very well due to arthritis, get to board and deplane first because of disabled status- and hardly any risk at all to anyone.
Zero. I'd say that's pretty darn effective.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I_23U047...
On the other hand, if you have something that a background check would reveal, then I don't disagree with some of the approach. The Israelis do it better than we do, certainly, but they also have a pretty homogenous society so it is easy to pick out the oddballs racially & ethnically.
While the overwhelming majority of terrorism is certainly Muslim & Arab or East African descent, we also have our fair share of homegrown terrorists - although our 20-something white male with a gun issue tends to be isolated to elementary schools and theaters, not airplanes. They seem to like small/young/liberal-teacher/defenseless, not 200 other adult passengers of varying sizes and shapes.
We haven't had an incident since 9/11... and we've been at war without end around the globe since then. I'm tempted to put some faith in whatever they are doing. It's kind of a bazooka approach, where the fly swatter might be preferable, but it seems to be working and its reasonably efficient, you just have to not wait until the last possible second to leave for the airport. Give yourself an hour (so you have it if you need it) and life is pretty peachy. Personally, I never spend more than 10 minutes in line, at the most, and I fly something like 100,000 miles a year.
They routinely oversell their seating space which is defrauding the customer. Number two I object to being processed. I'm not a side of beef or a chicken.carcass. Travel had become quite enjoyable since I quit using Greyhound with Wings.
I can't stand United/Delta/USAir/etc. Last time I took a United flight, I was the only one left in the gate area by the time they got through the 50 Premier/1K/Medallion Club & United Airline Credit Card holders boarding.
None of that junk with Southwest, if you are a frequent flyer, you will board within the first group of 60 people, so you will get an aisle or window if you want it, they make no other guarantees and I'm fine if I get what I expect & pay for. If you are not a frequent flyer, you can buy your way onto the first group list with a $12.00 fee. If you are rather large, $12 to not fit in the middle is pretty reasonable. I did volunteer for a bump once, I'd only get in an hour later (I was going home anyway), had my wife with me and they needed 2 seats... they offered 4 times the value as vouchers, and I chuckled and took it because the company bought us business class tickets... heck, we took 5 more vacations for free on that one.
Once you get used to that, it's pretty odd & inconvenient to go back to the other mess. I had an AeroMexico flight to Guadalajara, and I couldn't figure out what the hell they were doing, until I realized that you 'line up' by where you sit in the ROW. Window people board first (all window people). Then all middle seat people. Then all aisle seat people. Works great, unless you are one of the 40% or so that were traveling with little kids & whatever. It was just a clusterf*ck. It took 45 minutes to board that stupid thing (737-800), and Southwest does the same thing in 15 minutes. They only allow 30 minutes on the ground - 15 to unload, about 10 seconds to kind of clean it, and 15 to load. Pumping fuel & loading bags at the same time.
I don't check bags either, never will, if I had to dink around with baggage claim, it goes from an hour commute to Los Angeles or whatever into a half-day screw-around. People complain about my roller bag (it's not a big one), and I have no idea why, its smaller than most, has my laptop and my clothes in it, and it fits perfectly the narrow way into the bin. If it doesn't fit in that bag, I'm not taking it. pretty much as simple as that. I'm not dragging strollers, car seats, jackets, football helmets, guitars, skis, or the worst - I see a lot of people these days in a carry on bag with an animal in it (Cat/Dog, etc.). I'm a dog person myself with a 15 year old border collie I've raised since he was 3 months, but i'm not taking it onto a confined airplane, holding it on my lap, and letting it slobber all over the stranger next to me trying to enjoy their lunch. (and not really wanting the dog smell for 4 hours even if it's not slurping on you).
I have a lot of sympathy for airlines, it's the American traveler that has gotten pretty stupid, unreasonable, and rude, and they are just rather forced to deal with it. On the AeroMexico flight, although we're talking Mexican immigrants that probably haven't been home in 10 years or something, but oh my, here's my wife and I with a laptop backpack each and one roll-on carry on, and 90% of the people boarding were in line at the ticketing counter with practically a pickup truck full of crap going to Mexico. If you have 6 kids... why not take 14 bags/suitcases/cardboard boxes and take advantage of that 2 free bags per person thing huh?
Old women in the TSA line are probably the funniest, never fails, there will be one that wore cowboy boots or something (because they know they have to take their shows off right?), some big huge jacket that is really there to cover up the batwings because it's 80 degrees outside but they don't want to give it up to go through the scanner, the makeup is melting because they are wearing a jacket when its 80 out, and the buzzer keeps going off, and each time they go back through it and remove ONE of the 50 pieces of cheap junk jewelry they wore - seemingly to take everything they own for the trip, but afraid someone will steal the costume stuff out of their bag or whatever.
So the funny thing is, I have a vintage 24k gold Omega watch I wear from time to time, and frequently if I'm going for a board presentation or something, and I don't want to stick that in the bag. I take off everything else, do everything else and just leave it on and go through the scanner. The TSA officer always sees that is what is registering, and just waves me through because I complied in every other way.
For grandma and the cowboy boots, belt buckle that looks like a WWF championship, and the 50 gold-tinted nickel wire bracelets, they just turning them around to entertain themselves I think.
I just find the entertainment in it, don't get excited and go with the flow. I've learned a lot of tricks though:
1.) Never fly late in the day. If you don't want to deal with a bunch of BS, just get on the first wave of planes leaving. For Sacramento, going to the East Coast, I will almost always be on a 5:30 AM or 6:30 AM plane. For going to southern California, the LATEST I will leave is about 9 am. That gets me to where I'm going by around 10:00 am, and rental car counters are not overloaded, the continual delays haven't overloaded the air traffic yet, etc.
2.) Never check a bag, it's not worth the hassle. When I come home, I pay extra for the premium indoor parking next to the terminal, it's a whopping $5.00 more a day and the company pays it anyway. I get off the plane, walk across the sky bridge to the garage, get in my car and I'm gone before the bags are even pulled off the plane.
3.) On Southwest, if you sit in the aisle seat at about row 8-9 or so, you have a fairly strong chance of having your own row or no one in the middle. For some reason, old people will crowd into the first few seats, and most other people besides business travelers have someone with them and they are hoping for something better in the back. once they go past, they really can't walk back forward.
Last question. Why are 320 million people paying the penalty without benefit of trial, jury or lawyer for the crimes of 20?
Welcome to never let a good crisis go wasted. So saideth Herr Hillary.Seigh Heil? Sorry as Hell I don't serve the party though apparently many do.
When would I fly again? When I win the lottery and it's worth the the hassle and the harrassment to go get the bucks. Then I''d buy a vehicle and drive back. If I ever get to visit Siberia and Mongolia I'll fly foreign routes exclusively.
Of course, some libtard will scream "profiling" and "discrimination", and I'd probably get audited every year for the rest of my life (or for at least long as this idiot resides at 1600 Pennsylvania).
There is a Pre-Check that allows you to go thru Security with a minimum of screening - you still have to walk thru a metal detector but you can keep your shoes and jacket on and leave your laptop in its bag. The lines are short, too.
Southwest provides this service to its frequent flyers, as do some other airlines. I don't fly any other airline [see scojohnson] so I don't know who else provides the service.