More lunacy

Posted by $ blarman 9 years, 5 months ago to Economics
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Only read this if you want a laugh. That someone seriously thinks MORE Keynesian policies are going to fix the problems caused by Keynesianism in the first place, they are intentionally ignorant.
SOURCE URL: http://www.businessweek.com/articles/2014-10-30/why-john-maynard-keyness-theories-can-fix-the-world-economy?campaign_id=DN103014


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  • Posted by RonC 9 years, 5 months ago
    Progressives have, in my opinion, a rather juvenile view of economics. For example, it doesn't seem to matter to them how much or where they tax, they know the economies are cyclical and when it rebounds all will work out. Nothing they do seems to help the economy either. Stimulus, shovel ready jobs, chronie capitalism, nothing seems to help...so they change the way they account for economic down turns and then spew those "new" numbers in ground hog day fashion until someone believes it.

    If you stand up and say with growth and tax reduction we can re ignite the economy they sneer and call you a, a, ah CAPITALIST. If that argument doesn't turn the crowd their way, they call you a racist. I should ask, is it racist to want opportunity for all who wish to pursue it? Obviously it is.

    I believe Keynes himself knew, in the end, it was smoke and mirrors. The reality of running out of other people's money to spend finally caught up to him.
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    • Posted by $ 9 years, 5 months ago
      Actually, he did, and admitted as such to Hayek in the few years he had before he died. He admitted that after looking at the data and seeing the effects of his policies that he may have been wrong after all. Hayek's response was that of a classic gentleman.
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  • Posted by fivedollargold 9 years, 5 months ago
    Actually no. $5Au is in the Hayek camp. His point is that Keynes' has been misunderstood and misued by many.
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    • Posted by khalling 9 years, 5 months ago
      Yes. But I disagree with your point that Keynsian policy was used in the 40s and 50s. 1. Even Roosevelt knew he needed a strong economy and he brought in a number of Republicans and business people in his 3rd term and backed off the insane tinkering with the economy. The production capability of Europe had been severely wiped out. Short of the insane economic policies of R, which Truman and Eisenhower did not follow, low hanging fruit-producing for these foreign markets. We were the technological leader in the world at the time, we were just in a good position.
      2.We strengthened our patent laws in the eary 50s, in response to bad supreme court cases, which stimulated the creation of ne inventions, which is the only way to increase real per capita income of a large group of people over any extended period of time.
      3. Third world countries, can raise their standard of living quickly by just acquiring technology. But we have to invent.
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  • Posted by fivedollargold 9 years, 5 months ago
    Keynes argued that if it is necessary for the government to stimulate the economy through spending, it should be done by targeting sources of production. He was proved correct in the 1940s and 50s. Consider government spending by FDR in the 30s. His approach, largely make-work projects and price controls, brought temporary relief to the poor, but failed miserably at ending the Great Depression. In fact, it prolonged it. However, after Pearl Harbor, Federal spending shifted to building and expanding factories, with an astounding increase in productivity. After the war, these engines of production were shifted to largely civilian use and the United States became a superpower.

    After visiting Washington, Keynes was disgusted with the FDR administration's bastardization of his economic policy stating that He, Keynes, "was the only non-Keynesian in the room."

    Recent U.S. presidents, particularly Obama, have NOT been following Keynesian economic policy. Most media pundits have failed to recognize this. Obama, for instance, has been doling out billions to his crony friends and pet projects. If any of this largesse has actually had a beneficial effect on productivity, it is purely accidental.
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  • Posted by freedomforall 9 years, 5 months ago
    On occasion I imagine what I would do with a time machine. Leaving aside paradox problems and alternate timelines, I think preventing the birth of Keynes ranks high on my list of things to change.
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  • Posted by fivedollargold 9 years, 5 months ago
    $5Au needs to make a slight clarification. He should have said that the results of Keynes' policy were seen in the post-war years. There was no need for stimulus spending after the war. In fact, Kennedy's tax cut, although modest, would almost certainly have been supported by Keynes.
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  • Posted by teri-amborn 9 years, 5 months ago
    In order for life to move in forward motion at all times, you need to apply two principles:
    1. Loss prevention. and: 2. Growth.
    If economists are busy concentrating on growth without analyzing the loss prevention side of the equation, they will ultimately fail at stimulating the economy.
    A proper analysis of the economy begins with a proper analysis of life. The questions: Why? , What for (long-term)? and Who is going to pay/Who will benefit? should be asked and answered before any action is implemented.
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  • Posted by plusaf 9 years, 5 months ago
    Good for a laugh, all right... I unsubscribed from "Anti-BusinessWeek" some decades ago when I could no longer stand their left-wing slant.

    Now it looks like Fortune is falling off that same side. Such a shame.
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  • Posted by Herb7734 9 years, 5 months ago
    I know I have a twisty brain, but sometimes I am reminded of an incident that seems to have no bearing on the discussion until you think about it a bit. Here's what I mean: I went to an middle school that kept its indoor pool open during the summer and gave swimming lessons. One day a kid of about 10 came in and jumped into the deep end and didn't come up. The swimming instructor leaped in and pulled him out of the pool. After pulling him out and screaming expletives at him, he told the kid to go home and start his lessons tomorrow. The next day, the same thing happened. The kid was banned from the pool. Was he suicidal? No. He firmly believed that if he continued he would eventually start swimming. Maybe so. But there was a pretty good chance that he could drown. He was a perfect example of the return of Keynesism and Einstein's Theory of Insanity: Doing the same thing over and over and expecting different results.
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  • Posted by CircuitGuy 9 years, 5 months ago
    I read most of the article. I agree with the part about Keynesian policy, which I support, BUT I disagree with the author on two key points:
    1. As the article correctly says, we should run a surplus during expansions, which is right now if you count 2% growth. So we should be running a small surplus now.
    2.The article says the deficits can take the form of tax cuts and gov't spending on things that we really need. I say it should just be tax cuts. Fund things we need separately w/o regard to the economic cycle.
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    • Posted by $ 9 years, 5 months ago
      The fundamental problem with Keynesianism is the fundamental fallacy that government is a more effective and efficient allocator of capital than the free market. Remember, every single dollar government spends comes from taxes - ie money the people would have spent in ways that benefited them if they had had the chance. Taxes have a huge opportunity cost tied to them. The higher the tax, the less the economy has. Every dollar of taxes is one fewer dollar that individuals have to improve their way of life and one fewer dollar companies have with which to purchase capital or hire more labor - or simply to ride out a downturn.

      Government is essentially overhead - and in today's government a huge bloated bureaucracy that consumes the equivalency of our entire national production every year. Successful businesses are those who keep their overhead costs low, allowing them to focus the majority of their capital inputs on the productive aspects of the business rather than simply paying managers' salaries. And we haven't even gotten into the problems with graft, corruption, and cronyism, which are rife in our government today.

      If Keynesian economics actually worked, we should have seen huge economic boosts from both the Bush and Obama stimulus packages. What did we actually see? Stagnation at best. Why? Because government spending doesn't promote long-term growth or stability. Only investment in the free market brings that. I would also point out that neither of those spending binges used funds on hand - they used borrowed funds and the printing presses (bringing inflation into the fray to further erode the actual buying power of those very dollars and every other dollar in circulation).

      Keynesian economics have never worked and will never work. They didn't work during WWII. They didn't work during Carter's time (just compare to Reagan). They didn't work during either Bush II or Obama. The sooner we recognize this and realize that economic power can and must reside with the people for long-term economic stability, the better off we will all be.
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      • Posted by $ allosaur 9 years, 5 months ago
        "We" ain't the what the Democrat Party has become. In other words, "we" ain't "them." The challenge is convincing "them" to become "we" (us).
        Worse, some of "them" will blatantly pull the race card to make or try to make "we" sit down and shut up.
        Dino being picky here.
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        • Posted by $ 9 years, 5 months ago
          Agreed, but how do you reason with those who avoid using their brains in the first place? ;)
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          • Posted by $ allosaur 9 years, 5 months ago
            Well, Mr. Blast From The Past, it appears I came up with a challenge (a question) I can't answer.
            Guess I was hoping someone would tell me.
            Can't fix stupid must be the answer.
            Thanks for helping dino think.
            Sigh!
            What a would. What a world.
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            • Posted by $ 9 years, 5 months ago
              Just be grateful that your brain is larger - and more used - than that of a liberal. I think even the stegosaurus has more cognitive power than some of these people. ;)
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              • Posted by $ allosaur 9 years, 5 months ago
                Yesterday I threw away a catalog that showed a T-shirt that said that the something millions of years that brainless jellyfish survived is hope for stupid people. I'd like a T-shirt that said that but substituted libtards or progressives for stupid people.
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